Who's Responsible for Chuck Liddell vs. Tito Ortiz 3? | SiriusXM | Luke Thomas

Who's Responsible for Chuck Liddell vs. Tito Ortiz 3? | SiriusXM | Luke Thomas

18 133 views | 27 Nov. 2018

Golden Boy MMA staged and promoted Chuck Liddell vs. Tito Ortiz 3 and clearly are the principal party responsible for the fight. There's an argument, however, that if fans wouldn't pay for circus fights, promoters wouldn't stage them. So, who is responsible: the market or the promoters for taking advantage of the market?

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Krakkin 89

Can you get this show on iPhone podcast app?

Rob battlecryawesome

Entertainment. That simple.

Reggie Matthews

Hey luke on the whole consumers have the power stuff i think theres a little disconnect between entertainment and news. like people clicking on a informational news story shouldn't affect your opinion on how often you post about that because you don't control the news. I can understand on like opinion pieces and stuff but IMO if your letting consumers decide what you promote as a news/journalism based site your way off anyway cuz your articles should be decided by what happens not what people wanna read. Maybe all I'm sayin is theres responsibility on both sides. Consumers cant click on every conor mcgregor news story then complain about his domination of news but at the same time sites can't just say WELL YA READ IT! cuz theres a huge majority that just wanna read THE news, not news ABOUT mcgregor. Its hard.

CGoody 564

Last Detroit Lions fan? You mean there's someone besides me?!?!?! I must meet this man.

They have been my favorite team for ages since Barry Sanders is my favorite player of all time, and after that season they went 0-16 I couldn't help but love em'.

I live right around Philly.... The eagle's are my second favorite team, and I'm not ashamed to admit that when they play each other, I'm wearing a Lions jersey and hoping for the win against my home team.

It's not a great time to be a Lions fan... But that doesn't make me any less of one. If anything, I'm even more dedicated now.

Bryan Gunalda

It was a fake fight and knockout..why aren't you saying what it really is

MBF - Modern Homesteading

Hope is the reason why people buy, if Chuck hadn't of looked as bad as he did Saturday night, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

In My Opinion

This fight should of never been sanctioned. Lidell was like 3 weeks from 49 years old and out of shape.

Sko Bird

Did Chuck not want the fight... ? Seems people are trying to tell Chuck what he should and should not do with his life.

Billy Mays

fake news


3:45 fucken cool descriptin of the live chart beat analytics , showing what is hot, not, and where the lookers and listeners are coming from

Backcountry Enthusiast

Cocaine, fishnet stockings and red high heels are to blame for this. Ask DelaHoto about it and he'll give you the rundown.


I wasn't buying that, I new this was gonna be a shit show

danny Macarthur

some hypocrite shit luke come on brother! Also there has to be a reason why the price was marked down for this fight lol

Frankie Cal

Tito won get over it.


"Beating a dead horse" Luke's favorite topic.

Dan D

It's Chuck's fault.  He is a grown ass man that refused to face reality.


Just popping in to dislike Luke Thomas and his non-stop emotional ramblings.


Cant help myself ...where does Kevin lee fit in?

colton craig

Like is missing a huge point that makes his argument invalid as fuck we don’t just buy jones cards for Jones to boycott jones is to steal earned support from an entire card and his opponent. Way to much tunnel vision on that argument. This whole consumerism approach won’t work in an environment such as this

Janiter Inadrum

Stick to breaking down fight moves,,,please


With the Jones thing he keeps fighting guys I like so I buy the PPV I love DC and Gus so I wanna see them fight but if jones fights Smith or Corey Anderson or someone I defiantly won't be watching.


people paying for it is the problem. you would think after the "legends" aka "old guy" fights that bellator had over the years would smarten up the general public but no. people have seen ken shamrock vs royce gracie that had the controversial finish. bellator also had kimbo vs dada5000. yeah its a "famous name" but guess what they are old AF and cant go anymore....what exactly did you expect?

blame the promoter and the fans for watching it.


"We need to make some NOISE Arthur

Jonathan Marshall

Do you fools watch fighting or do you just skim through it. Chuck hit Tito with a straight left and wobbled him. What does that tell you?


Dana White

Hi T1000

Easy, Chuck's respnsible. No one made him come back after 8 yrs n sign a contract

Jew man Doo

Luke... The 2 people responsible are the 2 guys that willingly went in that octagon the other night, ready to fight. The fight was sad to a lot of people but let's not be too dramatic. Chuck took a big loss and that was sad, but he made a good amount of cash, and money that he probably needed. Sure, it was sad to see Chuck like that, but let's not act like this was a huge travesty. I just hope Chuck can hang them up now. You're still a legend to me iceman, and you will always be one.

Sutef J

Did he say if you think jones is the biggest cheater in the sport but still buy his fights you might aswell be his biggest fan?

Just Saying

The Iceman is a grown Ass Man!! He is responsible for himself.

Dr. Phil


Mad Mike

Still advancing the entirely specious argument that fans can either accept cheating and steroid use or stop watching MMA, I see. This argument has always been weak and absurd but, now that we're on the 20th time you've laid it out in exhaustive detail, it's also mind numbingly tiresome. I do appreciate, however, you pointing out that you are "media" and not a journalist. A rare instance of honest self-reflection.


Haha this discussion could not have started in a more appropriate place than face in palm

Eric Garcia

Luke, even you purchased it c'mon man give us a break lol


Of course you're going to have more response to Conor McGregor articles than to Demetrious Johnson because he's a celebrity. But you're also going to have a lot of people who'd click on articles about Drake or Kylie Jenner on your website. But those articles are going to damage your brand. Your key demographic are people who care about MMA, not casual fans who might click on an article about Nate vaping or Conors lates instagram post.


I hate Jon Jones but still buy his ppv but not just for him alone if Jones was fighting some crap nobody and the rest of the card was nobody’s there’s no way I would pay for the card I pay so I can watch all the other great fights on the card and I’m not going to not buy a ppv and screw over every other fighter on the card just to prove how much I hate Jones

Autism Walk

Two professional fighters. One is 43, the other 48. They both wanted to compete. There were no victims here, only volunteers.

Patrick NEZ

I'll tell you who definitely isn't responsible. Me, and all the others that didn't buy it. For me, I considered should I try to be supportive of Chuck and buy it? Ultimately, after thinking it through, I landed on "no." The only power a fan has over the direction of mma is in what we buy. I just couldn't see supporting this event overall, and even though I was a big fan of Chuck and will always respect and appreciate what he did for this sport, for me, not buying it is a form of tough love for Chuck. Bc ultimately, he needs to be done imo.


so boring..... Why not see people people fight at any age. Competition is competition.

Rex Smith

does he always talk like a nerd,,,,,,it sucked Oscar and Tito clearly new Chuck couldn't move,,,, Tito even said the guys Chuck trained with set him up with Tito,,,,,and you can say Tito was just talking shit until you see Chuck couldn't move then you should know that it was a fact ,,,,, Tito was afraid to shoot on Chuck even though he couldn't,,,,, Tito missed Chuck most of the time,,,,,he landed one punch and celebrated like it was for a title or Olympic gold,,,,,,what a douchebag,,,,,,let Tito fight a guy who can move,,,,,, Tito and Jon Jones should hang they can start a new douchebag martial arts for guys who have no sense and no pride and will fight anyone they know they can beat,,,,,, Tito is going to start call out disabled people next just so he can say he won,,,,,, martial arts is not for some people,,,,,, martial arts is about respect,,,,,,is about knowing you can handle anything,,,,,,it's about confidence,,,,,, fighting is about winning but when you know the other guy can't move then you don't fight him unless you have no choice,,,,,, Tito is a jackass,,,,,, anyone who can move in MMA can beat Tito,,,,,he knows that,,,,,, Dana white could beat Tito he knows that,,,,,,k send Ben Askren for one night to golden bullshit MMA and I'm sure Ben would do it for free Tito vs Ben,,,,,, the Tito can what it's like to be sitting duck,,,,,,I didn't pay for it because I've seen Tito for years and would never buy his fights,,,,,,but saw it on YouTube and was shocked they allowed Chuck to fight,,,,,,,that's the wrong way to start a promotion,,,,,,,I'll never watch it again,,,,, unless someone comes to fight Tito and whoop his ass,,,,,,I think CM Punk could beat Tito,,,,,,k well that was a joke punk can't beat anyone ever,,,,,,,I like Askren vs Tito,,,,,,, doesn't even matter if Tito is in different weight class


Who's to blame... All the people who profess to care about Chuck but told him what he wanted to hear & not the truth... that he should never fight again & they refuse to support him in it if he does!

Brent Jordan

No one protected Liddell from further damage a fighter wants to fight it's sad... Hackleman and Dana white truly care about Liddell


de la jota nd chuck

Munkyzz B


Kevin Jurkiewicz

Somehow they are going to blame Dana and ufc smh


4:10 - charred beet?

Sarcastic Genius

Has anyone seen Gavin?


Chief called.. this aint it.

nanzo scoop

I don't recall fans (hardcore or casual) beating down Chuck or Tito's door demanding this fight. The fight was sold to the public (by the fighters and promoter) knowing that people would be curious enough to want to see it. With some being willing to pay for it.

Promoters aren't stupid. Fighters aren't kids.

Yes, it's sad that old warriors on whose backs the industry is built still feel the need to fight (be it for money, pride or ego) however that is timeless story told over and over in combat sport.


Chucks camp is to blame. If they seen him spar and that’s what it looked like, then they sent him out there to get murdered. Bunch of yes men looking for a paycheck. No way that should of happened if they seen him spar like that and sent him out to fight


Luke & every other idiot who bought it share a chunk of the blame. What the hell did you think would happen?

Dominic Velando

To build on Stoney’s comment below this, mma media fans are hardcore fans. Casual fans eat what falls on their plate. Oscar explicitly said that he was targeting casuals. He said that he was banking on a captive holiday family get together audience to say “hey fuck it there’s a fight on and we’re all here so let’s all chip in”.

breathe and squeeze

dana is now bitching about this fight, but, he's about to put on silva-adensaya. dana's as hypocritical as they get.


Luke the

s rico

CHUNK LIE DOWN vs CHEETO ORTEAZE III good stuff cheeto but what took you so long ?? Such a good fight rivaled GUS VS JONES !!!

Ned Modelo

I had not one ounce of interest in this fight. I'm only interested in relevant fights, but the organizations don't seem to know how to make them. The UFC has all the fighters but don't use a competition/tournament style format. They just want to make big hyped up money fights based on nothing. The fans have been conditioned to want to see big names fight as a result.


UFC loves throwing stars to the wolves


I felt a tap - LIIIIIE !! dell



Willy Billy

If consumers won't give feedback on what they've bought, the market will be determined on past buy's without the likelihood of whether past buyers will buy again. Giving buyers another shitshow. People who paid should be able to criticize what they've bought...

Art Vandelay

"Who the fook was that guy?" - 20 y old casual fan looking at a grampa who could barely walk or punch being the main event in a pro MMA fight.


No one is to blame, Chuck's fault for taking the fight. Dana had him quit, he decided to return after so long. There's no reason for blame anywhere, Chuck made a bad choice and he paid the price. This happens in boxing too, just look at David Hayes, in his prime was a force to be reckoned with, retired (iirc), returned and he got slaughtered. As much as people might hate Dana, he called it right, Chuck shouldn't have been fighting but chose to fight. While the result is pitiful, I think it's insulting to push the blame to anyone but Chuck like he got foolishly manipulated. He decided to fight and he lost emphatically, I don't see what the big deal is personally. The real issue here is I think we're being too sentimental and things didn't go the way we'd have liked or we'd possible be singing a different tune like matching up Chuck with Jones; there's no blame to pass on to anyone but Chuck himself.

Craig Christ

Last time I was this early Chuck "Lie-Dell" was still 2-0 vs Tito


If I was responsible for the moves promoters make i'd be so much more satisfied with mma's current state. It's fight PROMOTION, the promoters target the masses (casual mma fans). Casual mma fans don't know what they want, they can be sold anything with the right marketing and promotion. promoters make their best guess at what they can sell the most of versus the resources itll take to make those sales, and that's the fights that are made.

EC Mal

Yes.... but just like the fighters Luke, us fans will never be able to come together as a collective voice

david ballard

The incident with Jon Jones GED and pay-per-views is sometimes you buy it just to watch the guy gets smashed the thing is is because he's been cheating he hasn't gotten smashed yet and there you go

Bruno m

Does luke just assume everybody spent $40 to watch one fight? They tried to do a black friday sale for $20 cause it was doing so bad but had to cancel it.

Dotar Sojat

The two fighters that agreed to step in the ring and fight! Stretch Armstrong much .

Rob D

Ultimately it’s chuck whose responsible for chucks decision to fight when clearly he’s well past his prime and is setting himself up for being embarrassed by Tito. No one held a gun to his head and made him fight, they offered him a huge pile of money and he took it.


This was a rather lazy analysis of the Monday morning blame game.

1:07 Let's start with that tweet "if you're one of the people who's saying this is sad and this fight should've never happened but you paid for the PPV, you're part of the problem." First off, that tweet was mentioned in a self-congratulatory way as if he was proudly recounting some type of profundity. It wasn't profound, it wasn't insightful, and it wasn't even accurate. In fact, it was simple, it was trite, and it was fallacious. Talk about some basic post hoc ergo propter hoc analysis.

By the time people started paying for the "View", the fight was already on. The only effect paying to watch had was that it would help line the pockets of the combatants that had already committed to square off. Eddie Alvarez put that into stark perspective tweeting out that he had purchased TWO PPVs for some of the legends who helped paved his way to fame and fortune and put him in a position where he could in good conscience pay double fees just to give back. The numbers may encourage future such events, but it's not like people paid when the fight was discussed or the event was promoted or Liddell was training. Spoiler alert: that's not how chronology works.


I thought it was sad but I streamed that shit for free. I do enjoy a good train wreck.


How can MMA fans affect what MMA media and UFC is producing when were outnumbered by the non MMA fans aka POP culture? Do MMA media have some kind of track of what precentage of the consumers are MMA fans vs POP culture?


god can luke stop gargling drughead jones balls already? JONES DOES NOT LIKE YOU LUKE!


This whole thing about assigning blame I keep seeing in MMA media is ridiculous. Chuck got in the cage willingly, so did Tito. Nobody forced them. Hell, fans weren't even asking for this fight AT ALL. If it's anyone's "fault" it's the consenting adults who participated in the fight and in the promotion. It was sad to see Chuck get knocked out like that but let's not act like this was some horrific tragedy. Chuck seemed to be more or less OK after the fight, it wasn't a particularly brutal KO or anything like that, hell Tito doesn't even have any KO's from striking(except for this one) if I'm not mistaken. The guy is not a striker and hopefully he proved a point to Chuck about his chin and maybe he won't fight anymore.


Chuck and Tito are responsible.


Also, there's no contradiction regarding Jon Jones because you CAN and SHOULD disagree and condemn him, but come fight day, he will DELIVER as he's always had. Tito and Chuck was a sad, cringe watch.
At the end of a card where Jon Jones fought there's 100% guaranteed chance I'm gonna get entertained.

Zach Rhoads

A lot of great points made. I bought the fight and questioned the entire time why I did. I didnt really think about being part of a bigger problem but it's an interesting thing to reflect upon as a fan.

Brian Asay

I would say its people like you luke. Who talked about it so much you kind of made it happen. If no one talked about it the fight wouldn't have happened